Jon Gold Accused of Being COINTELPRO On 911Blogger for Denying CD: Gold's Days Numbered?
It looks like the days when Jon Gold could get away with openly denying CD on both 911Blogger and TruthAction are rapidly coming to a close as more and more brave Real Truthers are willing to fall on their swards (get banned) by calling him out for what he really is - a "moron" or "COINTELPRO". The tables definately appear to be turning against the most notorious Fake Truther in all of 911Blogger history.
From the 9/11 Controlled Demolition Movement cutting edge: Announcing the truth to the officialdom. The politicians thread.
Anyone with a 70 IQ or higher should know it was CD.
I find your stubborn refusal to acknowledge the inescapable fact that the towers were blown up in a CD to be highly suspicious Jon. If you have some information that shows my own eyes are lying to me and shows Jones, Harrit, Gage, etc to be wrong about CD then spit it the hell out already dude. I personally don't trust you or your motives AT ALL. I don't think you have one single shred of information that shows the above listed researchers to be wrong about CD yet you persist and persist to try and steer truthers away from what is by far our strongest and most conclusive evidence. I am personally convinced that you are intentionally trying to drive a wedge into the truth movements core. If that is your intent I will say it is a success as far as I am concerned because I am seperating myself from you and any so called truther who denies CD right here and now. I consider you to be the latest version of Judy Wood's DEW crap and Morgan Reynolds hollogram planes garbage. You are full of crap Jon, CD is a fact and I will go to my damn grave before I sit here and listen to a so called truther like you try and steer me away from talking about it and exposing it as a fact at every opportunity. If you Jon as a so called truther do not accept CD as a fact at this point with all the evidence we have compiled proving it then you are either a moron or you are COINTELPRO. In either case I am done reading any of your posts and if I am banned from blogger for calling you out on this then so be it I don't care. It is time blogger put a stop to your canstant attempts to steer people away from our most powerful and conclusive evidence and start treating those attempts like they did attempts to sell DEW theories.
Sincerely,
Adam Ruff part of the 9/11 CONTROLLED DEMOLITION MOVEMENT.
And from True Faction:
http://www.truthaction.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=34442#34442
by Pavlovian Dogcatcher
Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 12:12 am Post subject:
zombie bill hicks wrote:
Fuck off with that petty label shit.
I'm not being petty, just forthright. I hope you might fuck off with the hollow denialism, please.
Rancho Truth wrote:
Pavlovian Dogcatcher- what's the significance/meaning of your user name, 'Pavlovian Dogcatcher'?
It is a reference to my propensity for catching people behaving like Pavlov's drooling dogs.
Jon Gold wrote:
"Controlled Demolition" is a HARD pill for MANY people to swallow...
Sure, because the logical implications of the fact that the buildings were CDed is more than many people are willing to consider. It's akin to telling a kid Santa isn't real. But we've all got to grow up at some point, and we aren't going to get to the truth by pussyfooting around it.
Jon Gold wrote:
You shouldn't have to be a scholar to understand the need for 9/11 Truth.
You don't, but you shouldn't cry bullshit on those who have the scholarship to understand matters you prefer to remain willfully ignorant of either.
zombie bill hicks wrote:
When I ask that the movement stop pushing hypthesis as fact...
I responded by pointing out that you are disparaging fact as hypothesis.
zombie bill hicks wrote:
...I can admit that I've lost faith in the 9/11 truth movement as a political force.
That's bound to happen when taking a position of faith out of an aversion to facts.
zombie bill hicks wrote:
Now I know that not only do I fail the litmus test for being a truther, I'm also complicit in murdering 3000 people.
Why do you embrace the disruptive effects of Jon dragging that melodramatic nonsense into this thread out of his refusal to address what had been said here?
zombie bill hicks wrote:
What a ride its been ..
Like dust in the wind, eh?
why would his days be numbered on his (real) personal psy-op?
this AtomicBomb feller is being sacrificed on the altar of banning to give an example to the flock of how NOT to disagree with Jon Gold. his use of the new, tailor-made for Gold "9/11 controlled demolition movement" meme is pretty clear evidence of the deception. Jon Gold came up with that term, everyone thought it was ridiculous and stupid so it had no currency, so they got a few sock/meat puppets to start using it. Dude, this is psy-ops 101! :)
So...you're saying that AtomicBomb is actually secretly helping
Jon Gold because he used the "Controlled Demolition Movement" title that Gold came up with, and therefore is part of the psy-op? Hmmm, I think you're over-analyzing it. From reading AtomicBomb's (Adam's) other posts, I don't get this impression at all. Gold is trying to drive a wedge through the "core" of the movement as Adam asserted, and I think Adam is calling Jon's bluff by saying, "ok, fine, I'd rather be part of the Controlled Demolition Movement than the Controlled Demolition Denial Movement." That's my interpretation, imho. I really don't think it is helping Jon Gold by pointing out that Controlled Demolition is the cutting edge part of the movement.
BTW, The title of the thread on Blogger is: "9/11 Controlled Demolition Movement cutting edge: Announcing the truth to the officialdom. The politicians". I updated the blog entry above with this link, and also copied a comment by PavlovianDogcatcher from True Faction in which PD rips the CD deniar fakes there (Jon Gold, "zombie bill hicks", and "Rancho 9/11 Truith") to shreds. The fake CD deniars' feet are being held to the fire like never before.
it's all consistent with Fake Truth 2.0
Which involves changing the framing of the debate from "Were there explosives placed, obviously NOT by Islamofascists?" to "Were THE explosives placed by Islamofascists?"
Part of this change is divvying up the new issue between the shills--some of whom will argue that the explosives were placed by Islamofascists--they will do their best to sound reasonable and sincere--and others claiming (in a shrill manner, like fanatics) that it was a deliberate demolition job.
The OCT will probably not change, mind you, this is pure movement derailment not for public consumption. Essentially what is happening is the fake truthers have realized that denying explosives is no longer tenable. They must accept that there were, suggest they were planted by al Quesadilla or Pakistan or the Taliban, etc. and argue that "we" cannot prove the buildings had to have been very carefully prepped, that it is enough that some evildoers smuggled in regular old terrorist bombs, explaining the total destruction.
The Truth Action forum I think is designed to make 911blogger look appealing to "people like us" - 911blogger has been set up relatively recently to be much more "MIHOPpy" with just the barest minimum of "ZIHOPpy" bait for cred among real truthers. One of its roles seems to be to focus the debate on the physical evidence now that most people accept it as self-evident and we should be moving on to subjects like the impending show trials of KSM et al run by uber-Zionist Alvin Hellerstein.
So why were atomic Bomb's
So why were atomic Bomb's and my comments deleted from this thread ?
I said that Jon was trying to lead the site and the movement against its wishes concentrating on weaker evidence whilst pissing on CD every comment he made.
I told him every time he did that, one of us would stand against him.
So he must either stop attacking other people's work which is better than his, or rename the site the Jon Gold Rebranded LIHOP 911Blogger.com and ban everyone against him so we can stop wasting our time and go somewhere progressive instead.
Comment was deleted along with Atomic Bomb's comment above.
I hope you are who I think you are
Thanks for your effort to expose Jon Gold and 9-11blogger's agenda from within. I hope your effort turns some readers to realize the deception maintained within that site.
This is my take on why there is such a malicious attempt by fake truthers to sideline CD.
http://wtcdemolition.com/blog/node/2291#comment-18416
We are by now so much used
We are by now so much used to psy ops, shills, fake truthers, deceptions, conter-deceptions, agents pretending to work for "our side" while insidiously working for the other that we tend to see them everywhere.
Judging by the rest of his post, the appropriation by Atomic of Gold's expression "9/11 controlled demolition movement" seems to be ironic. And at the same time the 9/11 truth movement IS indeed very much about controlled demolition.
In this way the original intended irony (Jon Gold trying to ridicule the movement by calling it the CD movement) is effectively turned around.
i like the Santa Claus bit...
It's like--look, we agree it's important to teach kids that the Easter Bunny is a hoax--but for god's sake leave Santa Claus out of it! I mean, debunking the Easter Bunny is one thing--he makes NO SENSE--a rabbit that gives away candy to celebrate Jesus' ressurection? WTF? Santa is HUMAN. Go ahead and try to convince kids that this HUMAN can't deliver toys, which he obviously does, and which the kids like a whole lot better than the fucking egg-themed chocolates. I mean Halloween has candy and doesn't require belief in anything... STOP HURTING THE CHILDREN'S HOLIDAY FANTASY TRUTH MOVEMENT!!
This comment on blogger will probably be deleted, so...
I figured I'd post it here before it is. Atomicbomb will probably be banned soon and his earlier comment has already been deleted. AllendeAdmirer's comments, below, are also being deleted to protect Jon from criticism that is too close to the truth. Yep, more and more people are realizing that "Seems like Jon is more important to the moderators of this site than anyone else who disagrees with him."
Well my comment was deleted so I am deleting blogger.
Since blogger sees fit to delete my comments I see no further reason to visit blogger any more. It looks like you get to spam all your anti CD garbage and anti DRG drivel all day long Jon and your opposition will be gagged and muted so go to it dude, knock yourself out. I for one am not going to pretend your position has any merit whatsoever nor will I be polite to you about what I regard as blatant disinformation. I support Dr. Jones, Richard Gage, Niells Harrit, and while I am at it David Ray Griffin 100% and I regard you Jon as a poison pill deep inside the "movement" who never misses an opportunity to belittle DRG and CD in general.
Whoever the mod is that deleted my previous comment I prefer to be banned rather then censored just for the record.
You know something this "movement" needs to man the hell up and start calling things what they really are and quit being so damn polite when disinfo rears it's head. Are you truthers or not? If you are maybe it is time you took a real stand on CD and let Dr. Jones and Richard Gage and Niells Harrit and all the people who have struggled so damn hard to bring out the facts and evidence proving CD as a fact, know that they have your full support. Not some half hearted semi kinda support I am talking about 100% support and putting your money where your mouth is by presenting CD as our strongest evidence. That does not mean we exclude other evidence by the way.
Jon's position on CD has no merit whatsoever nor can he articulate one valid reason why he does not accept CD as a thoroughly documented fact. Does Jon have an answer for the nano-thermite paper explaining why it does not constitute proof of CD? No? Does he have an explaination for WTC 7 falling at free fall speed for 2.5 seconds without CD? No? So why isn't blogger treating Jons anti CD position the same way it treats NISTs position or Judy Woods DEW position? Why can't you man the hell up the way I would if I ever met one of the NIST liars and tell Jon to his face that he is full of crap, CD is a fact, the evidence is conclusive, done deal. What is it about telling it like it is that requires censorship? What is going to happen to Jon and to Blogger if this is hashed out in public? Nothing that's what. Jon may get his feelings hurt, I might get called a name, big damn deal. We are dealing with the mass murder of nearly 3000 people so the hell what if the discussion gets heated? It should get heated, in my view it is not nearly heated enough considering what is at stake. You know perhaps some unedited, uncensored, frank arguments telling it like it really is are what is needed around here to break us out of this inertia. It has been 8 years! Let's hash this out without handcuffs on, geeeez!
911Blogger and truthers in general need to take a long hard look at the big picture and understand there is a reason JREFers and Judy Wood and Fetzer and the government and the MSM all relentlessly attack CD. Do you know why they all focus on trying to discredit CD? Well think about it for a minute and maybe the answer will come to you. Then ask yourself what the hell Jon is doing here trying to steer us away from CD and the big picture may just come into clear view.
If you as truthers have doubts about CD it can only be because:
1. You have not seen or understood the overwhelming evidence.
or
2. You lack the courage to take a stand in which case you are not really a truther are you?
Ah why the hell should I write any more since it will most likely be deleted so as to not be rude to the CD denialist(s). Is there more then 1 person denying CD on blogger? I cannot be polite to CD denial so ban away but at least don't be a coward and delete what I said.
Sincerely,
Adam Ruff
Screen shot taken because I just think censorship sucks.
In fact a lot of varied
In fact a lot of varied research is welcome by everyone I know, and I dont know what was wrong with letting the quality research here speak for itself. Instead of that, without canvassing opinion or asking for collaboration Jon has decided he knows best and the movement has to change, and to promote
dubious weaker arguments whilst at the same time undermining CD evidence without discussing what is wrong with it.
It was Jon who decided to force his minority views on this site, it was he who decided we had to change. In doing so he has caused offense to a lot of people who do think CD is the strongest evidence.
I would be interested to hear...
One of my "dubious weaker arguments."
Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? The facts speak for themselves.
Pointing out...
How the 9/11 attacks made the Bush Administration popular enough to launch pre-emptive wars with no opposition doesn't help us? Like the PNAC said, a "catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor" would enable them to do what they wanted, so I don't see how pointing to evidence of this hurts us. Fact #46 makes sure to mention "no one wants to say no to Bush now" so again, I don't understand how this hurts us.
I can tell you that the "9/11 Controlled Demolition Movement" with the obvious rules I mentioned will hurt this cause more than anything I've ever done. Thanks for nothing.
Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? The facts speak for themselves.
Delete Comment...
Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? The facts speak for themselves.
You may have noticed that my
You may have noticed that my answer to this alluding to point#46 has been deleted.
Seems like Jon is more important to the moderators of this site than anyone else who disagrees with him
CONCLUDING
BTW my 3rd comment that was deleted from this page was in reply to Jon Gold's "I would be interested to hear one of my weaker arguments"
My reply was " my personal favorite (From his FACTS that he links to with every comment now) is#46 ,Bush was more popular after 911. Well lets all grab our pitchforks now eh?" ...........DELETED
In reply to Jon's reply to Atomic Bomb's 'resignation' above
This was my final attempt to communicate on 911Blogger.com
-----------------------------------
You are being dishonest Jon.
Making statements that "Cd is not as valuable or conclusive as you think", and that "you have to be a structural engineer to understand CD" Is going a lot further than your perfectly innocent explanation of your agenda here isn't it? We have had this same discussion many times here recently
http://www.911blogger.com/node/21785 , and http://www.911blogger.com/node/21771 ,are two examples.
1.The fact that MSM or debunkers attack CD is irrelevant They are against us, They have not yet presented the CD evidence, nor the nanothermite paper and are attacking a straw man CD instead.
Any other evidence you choose to promote will be dealt with just as harshly by MSM if not more so because most of it is on much shakier ground and much less conclusive than CD.
The fact that most effort has gone to discredit CD only suggests is the most damaging evidence. Trying to select evidence based on how MSM portrays it is absurd , we must always promote the strongest evidence.
2.The majority of the movement clearly disagrees with you Jon- that CD should be relegated as evidence.You have lost this argument so why continue it every day?
3.With every comment you make, you promote your selection of 911 'Facts', which contain some very weak points , both in terms of factuality (Testimony is not necessarily factual) and in terms of relevance. Your selection therefore weakens the stronger arguments we have by diluting them.
They also exclude a lot of other evidence that is much more damning to the OT , but you have chosen to ignore that evidence. (For example the redundancy of the towers and the fact that demolition was not allowable environmentally)
4.Your Facts focus a great deal on Islamic terrorism, whereas there is no proof that Islamic terrorists were responsible IN ANY WAY for events on 911.
5.By promoting your weak selection of evidence,and determination to discuss Terrorist complicity within the preconceptions that exist in the West , you will dampen the motivation of any would be truthers , compared to the FACT that the towers were demolished.
6.It is very likely that we will never get a re investigation, in which case your argument that we need one to tell us if anything bad was done by our administration is useless. Most people realize something was done, and we may need to use that and motivate people to achieve change BEFORE a reinvestigation is ever allowed.
These points have been made to you over and over but you do not address them.
Your view is a minority one, but a disproportionate amount of commentary here is attempting to give credence to it by volume alone.
You are wasting everyone's time here by rehashing these comments incessantly.You are not interested in a discussion of your ideas, instead, you have an agenda to propagate them despite all criticism, and now, by deleting comments contrary to your agenda.
Your agenda, and the apparent bias of the moderators here in supporting it and censoring dissent, has severely damaged the integrity of this site.
Allende Admirer.
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AS This reply was not published , I assume I am banned from commenting now but not from logging into the site? It seems there is a new policy of selecting comments that survive for Jon to reply to, and deleting others that are too critical.
In any case I wholeheartedly endorse Atomic Bomb's final comment, and hereby conclude my attempts to interact with 911 blogger .com
Thanks, AllendeAdmirer, welcome to WTCD!
We need more folks like you and Adam to stand up and be counted calling out Jon Gold and the other blatant disgusting fake LIHOP shills wherever they spew their BS and essentially crap on the efforts of Richard Gage and other real truth advocates. These fakes have blood on their hands by their ongoing effort at directly aiding this bogus War on Terror, making sure that it continues to be justified based on deliberate islamophobic hate-mongering, dished out in absurd and indefensible Al-Quesadilla style.
Any lurkers out there reading this who blog on 911Blah-ger and True Faction, now's the time to expose these fake truth sites and shills once and for all on their home turf while their credibility is collapsing as we speak and their agendas are being exposed like never before. It's a perfect time to take the offensive and force the controllers of those fake sites to either stop becoming an instrument of disinfo, or relegate themselves to irrelevancy and disrepute once and for all.