Loizeaux Makes it Obvious That Thermite Was Used and Why

gretavo's picture

Below is a post from Apt. 911B.  Here's what I would add.  The fact that Loizeaux says that if it had been a conventional controlled demo the explosives required would have blown out windows of nearby buildings is a dead giveaway itself.  It shows what they are hoping people will believe--why?  Because it may well be true, and the biggest reason for using something like thermite to quietly melt the biggest columns without having to resort to huge explosive charges was precisely to say--but where are the huge explosions?  Just like with the twin towers, the columns were weakened with thermite precisely to minimize the need for more obvious explosive charges--not to eliminate them, but to minimize them.  Thermite is NOT used by demolition companies in conventional demolitions.  Loizeaux may or may not have been involved in the crime and even with his help in the cover-up he can claim plausible deniability since he may well be telling the truth about the effects that the necessary explosives (assuming no thermite) would have on surrounding buildings.  is this by now as obvious to everyone as it is to me?  Thermite means far smaller and fewer explosives, means less obvious deliberate demolition.

 

BBC Piece Post-Mortem: Mark Loizeaux and the Special Engineer

 

At 31:10 into the piece, Mark Loizeaux commits what I know to be a misrepresentation of fact. He claims that yes, some of the windows facing the building were blown out, but, he says if explosives of the type that would be needed to cut the columns were used, then, he says, “…all of the windows on the surrounding buildings would be blown out all the way around. No way around it.”

Yet, on Mark’s own website, the same exact page that we talked about the other misinformation from Mark, he clearly boasts about how that job posed a significant problem with the surrounding historic structures and there old glass, and they were able to demo the Hudson building, another steel framed structure, without cause hardly any window breakage. On the sides facing the buildings!

“Even with all the precautions to control overpressure, the age, existing cracks, and poor condition of glazing windows in vacant structures on the north, east and west sides of the J.L. Hudson complex, window breakage was a concern.”
...

“There was far less window breakage in adjacent buildings than glass company crews were prepared to handle. Many of the broken windows appeared to have been those which were cracked before the implosion,…”

Unbelievable. The arrogance of these people. He mentions the one job that he has detailed on his site as being very successful in keeping from breaking vintage windows facing the building that was demo'd.

UPDATE: The following is a great review, also at "the Apartment":

The Third Tower - A Critical Review

Looks like the BBC is pretty desperate and going with the "cover your ass" strategy: present a fair enough case for both sides but angle it all so that the uncritical (i.e. trusting the BBC) viewer gets the message that no matter what the evidence, the "nasty conspiracy theorists" are wrong.  this will work on a fair number of people determined to believe what they want to believe but I can tell you that the folks I talk to every day who are just starting to become interested are going to see right through the ruse.

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gretavo's picture

do you have a problem...

with illogical circular logic? if so, then you clearly are in denial and don't WANT to believe the official story, Srcubby. The other similar version of that paradox is "Thousands of people would HAVE to have been involved and since no one has confessed, then thousands of people could NOT have been involved and so it didn't happen that way." It's like shoving a hamburger in someone's mouth and then slapping them for not being a vegetarian. Or something like that. Whatever it is it needs a name so we can refer to it by some convenient shorthand--any ideas? Where is that link to the list of logical fallacies someone posted once somewhere?

gretavo's picture

here it is... it's a straw man i guess...

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

Of course that's the link when you want to innocently support the official holocaust narrative while ostensibly only wanting to teach people about fallacies. here is a better one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

hee hee...

gretavo's picture

but wait there's more!

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/

This stuff should be taught in every elementary school in the world...

gretavo's picture

Bonus Round

"But Bin Laden/al Qaeda confessed!"

is the above...

a) a thought-terminating cliché

b) an appeal to authority

c) an appeal to emotion (specifically wishful thinking)

 

gretavo's picture

Perfidiously harming a cause...

by defending it deliberately with faulty arguments (as our friend Nietzsche suggested we might do) is based on:

Argument from fallacy: if an argument for some conclusion is fallacious, then the conclusion must necessarily be false.

Man, can everyone else feel their IQ rising?  :)

gretavo's picture

i think wikipedia needs an entry called "Going Fetzal"

since it doesn't quite fit under logical fallacies...

Big_D's picture

Definetly a presumtion fallacy.

Sounds like cum hoc with a little circular logic tossed in.

Lazlo Toth's picture

Israeli Exploding Paint

There has been some discussion on the internet tubes lately about a thermite-based “paint,” or coating, which could be innocently painted on steel structural supports to masquerade as a “building’s fire-proofing,” only to be set off later by some type of charge or applied heat. This, of course, reminded me of an End Note from Chapter Two of Part Three from J. Bowyer Bell, Terror Out of Zion: Irgun Zvai Leumi, LEHI, and the Palestine Underground, 1929-1949, New York: St. Martin’s Press, 1977, p. 175.

“LEHI’s explosives problem was greatly eased by Yaacov Heruti, appointed head of the engineering/technical department in 1945. Eliminating the most desirable varieties like TNT or nitrocellulose, which required complicated production lines, but retaining the essential requirements (combustible, shock resistant to bullets, transportable, and not effected by fire or weather), in two months he produced an alternative. Not as fast as TNT and still not weatherproof, the new explosive had to be primed with nitrocellulose cores in each block. The tremendous virtue for LEHI, however, was that production was simple and the materials involved legal. Heruti opened a paint factory, purchased the necessary machines and material, and hired a worker. His employee cheerfully turned out paint in two varieties—one that would explode and one that would go on walls. The new factory did not supply all needs, so LEHI, like Irgun, continued to steal from the military and civilian industry, buy from the innocent or corrupt, and devise new formulas for diabolical devices.”

gretavo's picture

ride the elevator with a spray gun...

And coat certain columns in certain places. Why yes, it would take hundreds of thousands of milliliters of the stuff, and well over FOUR PEOPLE to do it! Clearly impossible, Laz. Nice try though!

gretavo's picture

AND someone would have noticed...

The people walking in with painting equipment and immediately said "Hey, are you planning to coat the inner core columns of the building with an aluminothermic compound that will be used to thin the columns so as to be able to use small amounts of explosives to break them apart and compromise the building's structural integrity?" What then, eh? What would the "painter" say to that? I'll tell you what he would have said: "Oh shit, someone must have spilled the beans. I give myself up to you, office monkey. Take me to the FBI and I will tell them everything!"

So clearly it could NOT have happened this way, and the demolition chimera is just that--a chimera!

Scary Israeli's picture

you are to estimating over our capabilities...

Mr. Toth.  We have only recently perfected this weapon of ass destruction... The exploding paint is still the many years off.

Lazlo Toth's picture

Exploding Thermite Paint?

Proof once again of the inherent super-genius of Gott’s “Chosen People.” What will they think of next – thermerisol/mercury in children’s vaccines to cripple a population with autism and mental retardation, GMO crops to kill off all the bees in order to generate world starvation, or the development of racially-targeted germ warfare?

“I say we [make mad sloppy love to*] all the compromised scientists, pharmaceutical corporate CEOs, AIPAC-controlled politicians, Federal Reserve and Wall Street investment bankers first, and then the lawyers.” — Wilhelm Shakespeare (from “Merchant of New Yorka”)

*EDIT: Sorry Laz, I think you misquoted ol' Wilhelm. I've made the correction for you! -gReT

kate of the kiosk's picture

what will they think of next?

although not sure if it's the same "they", let's not forget HAARP, especially as bush and wife attend the opening ceremonies of the 08 olympics in China. wonder if they will visit the devastated earthquake provinces...

gives me the shivers.. guess i've overindulged in this particular conspiracy theory.

Natl Geo had a pretty interesting spread on China going back a month or two. 

 

Lazlo Toth's picture

Henry VI - Part II, Act IV, Scene II

Right you are GrEtAvO. I did misquote the Bard of Avon, and here is the original:

All:
God save your majesty!

Cade:
I thank you, good people—there shall be no money; all shall eat and drink on my score, and I will apparel them all in one livery, that they may agree like brothers, and worship me their lord.

Dick:The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers.

Cade:
Nay, that I mean to do...

Dick the butcher, a character no one remembers, utters one of the few memorable lines from the entire three-part cycle of Shakespeare’s “Henry VI,” a play whose setting is the 30 year Wars of the Roses between the House of Lancaster (red rose) and the House of York (white rose). Dick's utopian idea to kill all of England's lawyers is his addition to the promises of the traitorous Jack Cade, who envisions a quasi-communistic social revolution, with himself installed as monarch. Cade alleges that all lawyers really do is shuffle parchments back and forth in a systematic attempt to ruin the common people on behalf of the ruling class. Jack Cade’s demagoguery is simply a calculated appeal to simple folks' longing to be left alone. In this play, one may recognize Cade's moral failings, yet still sympathize with Dick the butcher’s anger towards the oppression of the elite through their armies of lawyers (and bankers). Shakespeare was perhaps the first to note that there are those who will rob you at knife point, and there are those who will rob you with the point of a quill pen. Rock on Bill, you crazy poet.

Big_D's picture

I'm sure I don't need to point this out...

but here goes anyway. I have no doubt that some form thermite was used to weaken the structure's to reduce the amount of explosives need. Though it's self-evident by the pulverized concrete & building contents that plenty of high-explosives were used.

Just don't want us getting caught up in their circular logic.

gretavo's picture

you're right

it seems like there were definitely explosives involved, we should be clear about that.

Annoymouse's picture

Family Guy and DHS disagree......

DHS-"9/11 Truth, not speculation about controlled demolition...

Dragnet style.... just the facts..."
http://www.911blogger.com/node/16580#comment

Jon Gold-"If Controlled Demolition is the "best piece of evidence we have", and is the "smoking gun of 9/11," then WHY is it so EASY to use against us?"

DHS-"because it isn't the smoking gun that so many naive followers of false leaders claim, silly Jon Gold.

and you know this...... mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn"
http://www.911blogger.com/node/16585#comment

oh if we could only just focus on Pakistan the whole house of cards would fall......seriously though, all this DHS tool seems to do is bash people who talk about controlled demolition. what a fucking moron.

9-11 Family Guy's picture

again, you and your theories!

The reasons that the Calgary Herald and BBC don't try to debunk claims about the Patsystani wire transfer to Mossadmed Atta are:

a) they have shown how easy it is to disprove the controlled demolition theory--what part of NO ONE HAS SPILLED THE BEANS don't you people understand?

b) they are deathly afraid to take on the wire transfer story. even though nobody has spilled the beans about this one either they know it's the REAL smoking gun about Patsystani responsibility for Atta's miserly tipping at strip clubs and tehrefore impossible to debunk.

c) controlled demolition makes us all look as foolish as the Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth who, with no actual evidence for their claims must speculate endlessly.

d) the Patsystani story is AIRTIGHT and reveals everything we need to know about 9/11--who funded Atta's sexcapades, Bush's complete foreknowledge of the hijacking plan and efforts to make it appear as though they didn't actually happen, and just why it was that Bush wanted Barbara Olson silenced forever.

You stupid controlled demolition cultists are ruining everything that I and others have worked so hard to accomplish. If it weren't for your crap we would long ago have founded hundreds of worldwide chapters of Average Joes Obsessed With Patsystan and Saudi Arabia. MappingSharia.com and Muzziewatch.com would have supported 9/11 Truth long ago if it wasn't for all your pointless and misguided speculation about physical evidence. I hope you all feel good about how you've dashed the Familiesâ„¢ hopes for holding Patsystan and Saudi Arabia accountable!! Thank god they have me to hold their hands and comfort their crying women...

Lucky Larry's picture

look here you fat bastard...

you told me you had this movement wrapped around your fat little finger--all I see is more and more people getting curious about my buildings and absolutely fucking no one giving a rat's ass about Patsystan. Fucking hell I'm screwed.

Chris's picture

nice touch trademarking the

nice touch trademarking the Families Family Guy. im actually kind of surprised the real Family Guy hasnt thought of that yet........

dicktater's picture

The WTC 7 Collapse series: Meet Mark Loiseaux

The WTC 7 Collapse series: Meet Mark Loiseaux


Mark Loizeaux

http://aotearoaawiderperspective.wordpress.com/2008/07/10/the-wtc-7-coll...

Meet Mark Loizeaux. Mark Loizeaux runs a company called Controlled Demolition Inc.
Most of his handiwork have been shown on TV. he is a specialist in the field of Controlled demolition.
According to CDI website they do a lot more than Controlled demolition.
They do for example Forensic examinations on blast sites. They also work for the American Defence department and in fact they work for 5 different Government departments: Department of Defence (DOD), Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), Department of Justice (DOJ) and Department of State.

He is what you might call the US department of Demolition and a such very connected to the US Elite. So it should come as no surprise that Mark Loizeaux was contacted few days after the attacks of 911 to help with the Crime scene investigation the removal of the WTV 7 steel and debris.

He did his job so well that only a piece of steel about 40×60 cm has survived.

Knowing what we know about Mark Loiseaux background and connections it should be pointed out that the choice to ask him to be the BBC controlled demolition expert is to say the least somewhat suspect. The very man who prevented a crime scene investigation and who’s company was instrumental in the destruction of the crime scene that what the WTC and the
WTC 7 building in particular would have a definitive conflict of interest yet the BBC makes him the sole demolition expert whose say so they is used to debunk the WTC 7 controlled demolition evidence.

In the interview Mark Loizeaux claims that;
The preparation/calculation takes months
The execution takes months with loads of wiring and tons of explosives.
The process is noisy and impossible to hide and further more
in order to bring about the demolition you have to remove inner walls and toxic materials like asbestos etc.

However this is easily refuted.
While the preparation might takes months it is not necessary to do these preparations on site.

I used to be a model maker and SFX engineer together with my husband who is an electronics engineer specialised in Moving Models and computer controlled mechatronics and we were asked to solve the most amazing problems in the real world and we are aware of the many ways of working out real world solutions with the help of computer simulations and it took me only 10 minutes last year to find a special software program dedicated to simulating controlled demolitions. In fact the program was advertised as follows:

Blast code

Ain’t this fun! LOL.

What this program does for you is the following: Provided you have the building drawings and the list of materials and were and how much was used this program will allow you to build a 3D model of the building you intend to demolish. It will respond to the material parameters you set and it will allow you to set the demolitions as you calculate them and it allows you to blow up the model until you get it just right.

What this program also allows you to do it engineer amazing demolition sequences for SFX scenes in films, but nothing it stopping you from replicating the programmed demolition sequence in real life. For example you fly a 3D Boeing 747 into a tower and you design the collapse so that it seems to originate from the impact of the plane. The only thing you have to do is print out a list of where to place the explosions and where to have the planes hit the buildings.

In other words you have all the time in the world to prepare this spectacular real world SFX show in secret with a very small crew of perhaps military trained special ops. programmers and you can fail to you harts content until you get it just right.

CDI is a state of the art Company and this software may have only become available for the general public I’m sure that the programmers and their Pentagon handlers knew about this long before they start to sell this as a plug in for the 3D maya software package.
Now if a female 52 year old ex model maker and SFX engineer can come up with this one, what do you think are the odds of someone like Mark Loiseaux having known about it. They are after all America’s leading state of the art Controlled demolition experts and I’m sure that he would not leave his multi billion operation open to litigation in case anything goes wrong if a relatively simple 3D software modelling program designed for this purpose can help him in preventing just that.

In the BBC documentary mark Loizeaux states that the on-site preparation would be impossible to hide due to the noice and the cabling etc. This is of course nonsense.

In 1999 a special kit became available for Controlled demolition companies to enable remote controlled explosive sequences. These kits don’t come falling out of thin air, they are developed with companies like CDI in mind in fact it is very likely that these kits were in fact initially developed with the direct cooperation of Mark Loiseaux. Both companies are members of the same society for Explosive Engineers of which Mark Loiseaux was one of the founding fathers.

So that takes another of his only in a screenplay arguments away.

His next argument: In order to bring a building down in a controlled demolition one has to take out most of the interior and the toxic materials such as asbestos etc.

I’m sure that if you want to bring a building down safely you would have to go through a thorough preparation with the safety of the environment in mind but of course this was a whole different kettle of fish. This was about murder and mayhem; an apocalyptic “Diehard” Bruce Willis flick for real.

No safety precautions necessary. Just the right amount of explosives at the right place and “Kaboom”.

So that takes care of that argument. Is it me or is he beginning to sound like a liar to you to?

The last one is the toughest: What kind of explosives where used? I’m not an explosives expert but when I googled Thermite I got a handful of Video’s showing me exactly how to make it. In fact the material used are readily available and each is of their own fairly harmless. I decided not to place a link here because i don’t believe in explosives and have no wish to give people access to them. I don’t think I could live with myself if some young punk would like to try some thing silly with stuff he downloaded of my site. So far from being a secretive military explosive compound it is a well known easily made high powered explosive.

In fact I remember that even after the events of 911, I was able to order large quantities of aluminium powder with out any restrictions even though it said on the packing that it was highly explosive.

My conclusion about Mark Loizeaux’s appearance in the BBC documentary is that his appearance is suspect. What he tells us can be easily disproved and this makes his appearance even more troublesome. A man who owns the company specialised in amongst others Crime Scene Investigation did not only ignore the basic legal requirement: to keep a crime scene in tact until a full investigation has been finished and which actively assisted in the destruction of said crime scene is hailed as the specialist to put all Conspiracies to bed and he does so by telling provably incorrect facts.

Don’t believe me do your own investigation.

dicktater's picture

Jerome Hauer oversaw NYC's response to building collapses

I don't like Jerome Hauer. Never have. I've always thought that he was a creep.

Before 9/11 - Hauer oversaw NYC's response to building collapses

http://www.911blogger.com/node/16587

Submitted by DoYouEverWonder on Thu, 07/10/2008 - 8:45am.

Just found this NYT's write up on Jerome Hauer from 1999, while he was NYC's OEM Manager.

Part of Hauer's job was to oversee the investigation of any building collapses.

Apparently, Hauer knows alot about ways to bring down buildings, just like he knows a lot about bio-terrorism and WTC security.

------------------------------------

What Could Go Wrong? It's His Job to Know

By RANDY KENNEDY
Published: July 27, 1999

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B01E2DA1E3EF934A15754C0A...

JERRY HAUER, to put it bluntly, likes guts. Meaning viscera, innards, the stuff things are made of.

There is one story he tells in which this fascination is quite literal (more on that later). But another illustration, a bit more metaphorical, his hard to miss when you walk into his office on the 23d floor of 7 World Trade Center, otherwise known as ''the bunker,'' the $13 million bulletproof, hurricane-proof, blackout-proof emergency crisis center opened by the city last month.

Mr. Hauer's office looks nothing like a bunker. It has comfortable chairs and picture windows that frame the Woolworth Building. But in one corner there is also a big stack of mismatched bricks that attests to the unusual function of this office and the unusual fascinations of its holder.

As the city's chief emergency manager, Mr. Hauer oversees the response to building collapses, of which there have been no shortage over the last three years. And as he has sifted through piles of rubble, he has made it a point to squirrel away a chunk of each disaster. He has a brick from 540 Madison (office tower; partial facade collapse, Dec. 7, 1997), one from the entrance to the Selwyn Theater (collapsed Dec. 30, 1997) and from an apartment building at 172 Stanton Street (partial collapse; demolished Jan. 24, 1998). There's also a piece of steel about the size of a slice of bread, a cross section of the beam that fell from the upper deck of Yankee Stadium on April 13, 1998, forcing it to close.

When he found out someone was about to put the beam in a Dumpster, he almost lost his temper. ''I said, 'Don't throw it away! That was two weeks of my life.' '' Those weeks were, he adds dryly, ''loads of fun.''

For much of his professional life, it has been the task of Jerome M. Hauer, 47, to know a lot about how things work so that when they stop working -- when they fall down, when they get blown down or blown up, when they freeze or burst or burn out -- he knows what to do. Like all self-described emergency junkies, he sits around all day thinking up horrifying ways for things to be destroyed and people to die and then hoping that all his plans stay on the shelf.